Paleo Going Global with Paul Jaminet – Paleo Magazine Radio #93

welcome to p.m. our paleo magazine radio where we bring you paleo nutrition exercise and lifestyle perspectives from both the experts and the everyday pmr is brought to you by paleo magazine the first and only print magazine dedicated to the paleo lifestyle and is hosted by tony federico as you may have noticed paleo is growing exponentially in the united states there’s more paleo products than ever before and events like paleo FX are drawing thousands of attendees but what about the rest of the world what’s going on in the global paleo movement well the very first Berlin paleo convention just happened and Paul GMA author of the perfect health diet was in attendance as one of their keynote speakers today on the show we’re going to talk to paul about his experience and what he thinks about the state of paleo outside of the USA in the second half of the show we’re going to bring adam fra on for another installment of big-picture paleo today’s topic self-acceptance vs self-improvement so grab your lederhosen and your loincloth paleo magazine radio starts now hey everybody we’re here with Paul jamming a he’s been a guest on this show before but we wanted to bring him back to talk about the new breakthroughs in the science of the perfect health as well as his recent trip to Germany for what I think I’d be the first ever international paleo convention the Berlin killer convention that has happened this past month welcome back to the show hi honey it’s great to be with you so let’s start off with your recent trip to Germany when did you first find out that would you to be a presenter oh it was probably about six months ago I in january-february and what was the suggested topic or what were they wanting you to discuss during the trip well they asked me to speak on natural healing of chronic diseases and especially chronic infections the talk was videotaped so it should be on the web at some point and that’s a really good topic and that’s when I hadn’t spoken on before so I was really pleased to have a chance to talk about that and it was a lot of fun it was a great meeting absolutely now did you give the talk in German no okay oh I gave it I gave it an English the majority of the talks at the meeting were in Germany they had three toxin English myself there are led words from London spoke about movement and then they had Adele Musa of Bursa todos give his talk in English even though he’s a native German speaker it would have been great if he did a dual presentation yeah that’s a little tricky though yeah I can imagine given one presentation is hard enough so tell me about the event itself when you first arrived what did it look like I’ve been a paleo FX I’ve been ancestral health symposium here in the United States you know I kind of have a feel for how those events shake out we’ve discussed both of them on the show but what about the Berlin paleo con what was your feeling about the paleo movement in Germany and and this specific event well you know it reminds me of like the first paleo FX you know it’s like everything’s really exciting and there’s a ton of volunteers and everybody’s really excited to you know work together build something up you know I think paleo and Germany is right about at that stage I remember the first peel FX I’m sure you do too there were volunteers all over the place and you know it was just a ton of fun yeah and and this one was like that one of the volunteers picked me up at the airport the day before the meeting uh you know there were people helping out I joined in helping out the day before guys moving stuff around moving refrigerate Dirksen it was just a really fun event one difference with the paleo FX it wasn’t in a you know a big event center convention center right on it was basically in East Berlin just the other side of the berlin wall so you can take a short walk to the the old berlin wall oh well I and that’s kind of a hippie area you know it’s kind of the poorest section of Berlin it used to be an industrial warehouse area sand and they’ve converted a lot of people industrial warehouses into a hippie leg space mm-hmm so the event was held in this place called the new market no hi Matt it’s like a bunch of big warehouses that have been partitioned uh you know but it’s very kind of hippie like it’s got a progressive vibe yeah and it

worked out really well you know so they had like one area of the warehouse devoted to vendors and movement sessions so they had a very large that they had a you know climbing wall pullip bars so there were movements sessions many of them were outdoors during the day they had a big auditorium seating over 300 and they had a bar at the back of it of course and then they had a big food market and they had two admissions they had you know a full price to get to the speeches and the workouts and the vendors and then they had a separate food market and that work really well because whenever he got bored with the talks or you know like me you didn’t understand the German yeah you know you could go out and get food and you know it is really happen throughout the day now were you able to discern if there’s a particular type of paleo that’s in vogue in the German Paleo community or the European Paleo community because we can see things kind of coming in and out of style within the broader paleo context maybe low carb is hot for a particular amount of time and then maybe more high carb or you just see these different sort of waves coming in and out bulletproof coffee or you know just whatever the case may be we able to pick up on any of that at Berlin paleo convention yeah one thing I was surprised at and impressed that was how big PhD is especially considering our book hasn’t been translated the German yet hmm you know a few paleo bucks have come out there the hartwig’s whole30 book has come out a few others but you know really paleo is just getting started there one of the things that was interesting as so many of the leaders of the german paleo movement eat the perfect health diet and the two organizers of the conference policy Horst and Leon beneden Scott introduced to paleo through our book and have been eating the perfect health diet so that’s kind of why I was the American representative at the meeting I also spoke the next day at the German paleo Medical Society and I was the one American speaker there and I just had all these doctors coming up you know saying we recommend your diet to our patients telling me they’ve had really good results and some of these places are quite large there was one clinic that’s got like 40 doctors the chief nutritionist there eats PhD he lost over 100 pounds on her diet and he said he feels better at 60 than he did at 30 I was a good testimonial and I yeah that’s a good one and anyway he’s been recommending our diet all their patients and he said they’ve had some really remarkable cures you know just from daya the German paleo medical society is there an equivalent here in the United States you know we’ve got some paleo doctor kind of networks and websites and things like that but is this something very different or something similar it’s something similar this was there a third annual meeting and they’ve been putting all of the abstracts into the Journal of evolution and health which is the ancestral health society’s scholarly journal and they recorded all the talks so my talk there will be out on video also and we had a question answer session afterward they had a lot of really intelligent questions and maybe because Germany is more compact it’s easier for everybody to travel to Berlin on than it is for American physicians to meet up sure you know I think they had a really good turnout and a really active well-connected group who stays in touch actually one of the people at the video mention was Lena say s of the ancestral physicians group here she was going there to recruit physicians internationally to be part of the of the network yeah you know it’s really good that so many doctors are getting on board many of them told me you know we really want to get our patients on your diet but it’s really hard to figure out how within the confines of medical practice to do that even get two minutes you know with them to talk about diet and nutrition and you know what can you say in two minutes it will be persuasive so some of the same challenges that physicians face your United States with sort of a quick turnover of patients and not a whole lot of time to really sit down and dive into health subjects yeah that’s right it’s really hard for them to communicate natural healing methods and I think it’s pretty important for us to get our book out in German that makes it a lot easier they can just recommend a book that’s something you can fit into most doctors meetings right hey read this hey excellent so you had some other news during your trip or at least something that you announced recently and it looks like you partnered with some people in Berlin to get a PhD menu in a restaurant can you talk about that yeah that’s right it’s actually in disel Dorf uh uh and hustle dark it’s a smaller City than Berlin but it’s a business financial and fashion capital as a center of the fashion community in Germany and the restaurant is on the Koenig’s la which is the busiest shopping district in Germany and sort of like Fifth Avenue in New York xsarahx

it’s a prestigious location it was Fashion Week at the time I was there and so they had you know whole tables with models eating dinner dice it was a lot of fun and anyway so we held an event on Monday slice but basically spent most of the day training the kitchen staff and the managers on the perfect health diet and you know helping them to improve their meal to sign and then we held an event in the evening we held a seminar and I gave a talk and introduction to the perfect health diet and we gave a three-course dinner while we were eating and I interrupted my talk periodically to explain the design of the meal did you tell us a little bit about the three courses that were served well the first course was a soup primarily a vegetable soup and I talked about the vegetables with some of the flavorings in the soup you know so it’s good for you like when you have a salad for it to be complemented by a fat or oil right which helps you get many of the fat soluble nutrients into your body out of the vegetables and also with an acid and that’s why the class and salad dressing is olive oil and balsamic vinegar right and so the soup add some oil and acid with the vegetables so it’s sort of you know like a mini salad but what’s yeah with some stock then we had the main course and it was mashed potatoes and sweet potatoes with a bead and spinach salad with a surf and turf we had salmon shrimp and ribeye steak excellent uh some mushrooms have forgotten which kind of mushroom they were but they were delicious and some sauce on top so that was the main course and then there was a special dessert which worked really well so it was a fruit and mosley but it was a PhD mosley alright so notes I know it’s gluten-free and it had some yogurt and citrus sauce with a mix of like four different citrus fruits they had a grapefruit orange lemon lemon I think it was really good how do you think it went over with the guests really good i think we had people come a long way and a lot of them stayed you know an extra 40 minutes or so to talk with each other and the me two of them drove 250 miles to come well another couple came 120 miles it’s good we have some enthusiastic fans that’s pretty cool man it must feel pretty good to go to something like that and see that your work is touch people to the degree that they would drive 250 miles hundreds of miles to have a dinner with you so you’re doing something right yeah it’s exciting it’s very fulfilling and we’re excited about the restaurant you know one of the things about our diet is it’s it’s very delicious and very satisfying and it does bear close resemblance to gore food right Russ Crandall and I gave a talk at the ancestral health symposium a few years ago about ancestral gourmet cuisine and why your food tastes really really good my wife and I are working on a cookbook goal and it’s good to get into the gourmet restaurant world and you know hopefully we can show people a better way of eating and you know that you can make really really delicious food and still be extremely healthy okay and having a a restaurant to tap is a great way to test recipes so probably a good resource for your cookbook yeah that’s right and one of the chef’s there will be coming to our October perfect I’ll to retreat in order to help us with the cooking also and she’ll get to learn from my wife uh you know I hit the retreat we teach home cooking mmm it’s a little bit different right I gotta scale it up a little bit well it’s fun you know the emphasis is on really easy preparation right so making things you know that you can make at home in 30 minutes or less teaching you about meal templates where you can vary be ingredients in many different ways so you can follow the same template you know but get many different flavors and that way you don’t get bored but it’s really easy mentally you know when you go in the supermarket it’s very easy to shop when you consult it’s very easy to cook and there’s not a lot of mental effort that you have to put in and not a lot of time but you get a really delicious and healthful meal you know so that’s the retreat whereas in a restaurant presentation on the dish you know we don’t pay much attention to presentation i right but they do and so there’s kind of an artistic element we don’t worry too much about the cost of our food at the retreat so I you know I shouldn’t say we charge a lot of money but you know we charge enough that we can get really good quality food over the course of a week and you know not have to worry about cutting corners at a restaurant they get really high quality food you know select they got wild caught salmon from Iceland that apparently is really hard to obtain nice hat you know they showed me all the other food bait stars so one of the things we had to think about was like you know what’s the right portion sizes that plays into pricing when the ingredients are expensive so there’s a lot of trade-offs restaurant managers have to think about I think they’re really on their way to

having really delicious satisfying food the people who want to come back to again and again that’s cool man you know I’ve been watching some cooking shows on Netflix or they’re actually releasing quite a few really compelling programs but I remember watching one of the mind of a chef episodes and it was a Norwegian chef and it’s just hyper local ingredients super fresh and I’m looking at this and I’m thinking to myself man this is one hundred percent paleo perfect health whatever you want to call it it seems like they’re starting to be a tighter relationship between really really high class high quality cuisine the stuff that’s really cutting edge and what we’re doing in the Paleo world which is fresh plants and animals basically with with kind of a minimal amount of preparation or just enough preparation to really Express the ingredient to its highest degree yeah I think that’s true so you know one of the things I talked about in my seminar at the restaurant was what is the basic definition of Bailey oh well you know it’s the type of diet somebody might have eaten in the Paleolithic and really the only definite requirement you can make about that as it has to be natural whole foods sure you know but there’s many different ways to form a natural whole foods diet and in fact many of the vegetarian diets are natural whole foods mm-hmm and probably the reason they have some health success stories to brag about is because they’re replacing donuts and cookies and cakes with yep natural whole foods you mean those things are bad for you unfortunately yeah sure um you could make a claim that vegetarian diets are paleo yeah absolutely but I think there’s a lot more to good health than just eating natural whole foods and you need to be nutritionally balanced and so on and i think the paleo movement has been migrating in that direction and you know getting to a more healthful place and actually a more mainstream kind of place on you know in place that can appeal to a very broad audience so maybe not extreme portions of rare beef or whatever for every meal yeah no I don’t think that’s the future of baliya yeah you know it is prejudice a lot of mainstream people have the paleo means caveman diet and I gave man a hunks of meat and my child so that’s all it is it’s an all meat diet yeah something like that maybe with a few leaves and twigs and berries could thrown in if we can get a few more of our books out especially our cookbook hopefully we can blow up that perception right and you know help to help people see that there’s a little more to the ancestral movement or paleo than just eating meat and wearing leopard skin which you know in the right context might be a good time but maybe not every day now that seems to be that in that point that you’re making their that seems to be one of the things that’s kind of spooked a lot of dietitians and spooked a lot of doctors here in the United States you know they’re looking at this extreme version of paleo which I don’t really see that being practiced all that much when I see regular paleo dieters honestly I just don’t really even see that very much at all you know this is kind of extreme carnivorous approach most people do eat a relatively what I would say balance and quote unquote normal diet even when they’re on paleo do you really see that as as the the way of the future is its kind of mainstreaming it to a degree or really more mainstreaming the perception would be perhaps more accurate to put it I I think mainstreaming both behavior and perception every movement starts with some early adopters who are innovative people and they like to be doing something new they like to be doing something different than other times should get up yeah and that tends to lead people to go to extremes and for a while and in paleo there were a lot of low-power people who are excited to you know have discovered something that work but that was different when everybody else was doing you know in low carb is a simple thing that’s different and so a lot of people did go to extremes and then a lot of people had some negative health consequences you know trying to follow that but I think like you said there aren’t that many practitioners of extreme low carb anymore so the practice has definitely moved and I think the perception it follows the practice with you know maybe a lag of a few years so I think the perception is changing and I think it will continue to do so europe where palios maybe you know him the ancestral movement is maybe four or five years behind they’re still trying to figure out what is it right on it was funny talking to the kitchen staff they thought that I would approve of using almond milk as a fat for a lot of things hmm and I said no I prefer you use egg yolks and coconut milk and what was their thought process behind that well there’s an awful lot of paleo treats made using almond meal and it’s also they wanted to have a few vegan or vegetarian dishes on the menu and almond milk is compliant with vegan vegetarian that’s not that almond milk is bad but I think they can do things a little bit better and make things a little more

flavor from you know there’s also no a minute face egg yolks and coconut my office that’s your jam I think we use a lot at home do you see some lingering saturated fat phobia in Europe or in Germany when you’re working with some of the cooking staffer at the convention I know that’s a you know sort of our heritage in the American nutritional sciences the policies and information that came out of the 1960’s and 1970’s did they have a similar adoption of a low-fat methodology or were they relatively accepting of dietary fat throughout those decades I don’t know the history but I didn’t come across that on my trip nobody was fretting over egg yolks no you know the people I met yeah I had really good attitudes toward food but we had a couple of other events there was a dinner Friday night put on by the organizers of the paleo conference and they had really terrific home-cooked food that was very impressive and it you know it was it was pretty much perfect health diet food you know but there were things like beef hearts do fruit and stark salads tapioca and fruit salad for dessert any sauerkraut yeah all right nice can’t go to Germany without having some sauerkraut right yeah there was sauerkraut there whereas kombucha oh yes there’s a few kombucha places just getting started in germany won I guess Germans don’t know too much about what that is but they’ve got some really interesting flavors so that was fun and then at Saturday night we had dinner at so bonds which is a restaurant in Berlin oh yeah yeah yeah that was a as far as I’m aware maybe the first officially paleo restaurant maybe even in the world yeah that’s what they said the first paleo restaurant in the world and that was an interesting menu you know so they had a lot of carb like things in that hors d’oeuvres that they distributed but you know so you could call that more toward PhD than I was expecting it was really pleasing I think how things are going there and I think it’s gonna have really rapid growth that’s awesome well I think you’re a great ambassador for paleo and and specifically your version of the Paleo diet the perfect health diet and I couldn’t imagine a better person to go out to Germany and represent the American or Western Paleo community you always bring interesting ideas to the table do you have any new sort of interesting ideas to kind of get people’s minds going I know when I listened to your talk at the ancestral health symposium a few years ago about just the different triggers for healthy circadian rhythms those are things that I’ve continued to put into practice like trying to get hot during the day and having social interactions during the day and then cooling things down and becoming a little bit more prep solitary at night anything going around in that mind of yours to get everybody thinking yeah well I’m always thinking and so every once in while I actually come across some thoughts that are worth communicating you can always check out our blog at perfect health diet calm and look for some post you’ll probably the ones that will be most new to the Paleo community earlier this year I did a series on potential autoimmune risks from red meat and basically from mammalian means you know but the main mammals that people eat our beef lamb pork you know mammals are relatively closely related to us that’s where a memo right and that means that there’s a little bit heightened risk of autoimmunity hmmm in the you know the places where breve add genetic differences with the other mammals so it turns out red meat can be something of an autoimmune risk and it looks like it is for Hashimoto’s I bought there at ism and so people with Hashimoto’s would do well to avoid red meat well and eat fish shellfish and bird needs like chicken or duck so really trying to eat from plants and animals that are a little bit more genetically different than us can be a sort protective against autoimmune conditions in some cases yeah interesting and another when I did not long ago if you remember my ancestral health symposium on weight loss I made the point that there are many health improving causes of obesity as well as health damaging causes of obesity that means that some methods of weight loss are going to be health damaging if you just take away the health improving things that then to increase our way then you’ll damage your help and if you just say my goal is weight loss no matter what the method then you’re going to embrace any weight loss method instead of a mecca billion approach yeah whether it’s health improving our health damaging and you’re likely to include the health damaging methods of weight loss and that may be why a lot of people suffer worse health when they die hmmm something similar goes on in the bodybuilding world where it turns out there are health improving methods of gaining strength and muscle mass but there are also some health damaging ways to do it probably some pretty well-documented ones when it comes to performance-enhancing drugs and and things of that nature yeah so the

performance enhancing drugs are one definite health risk but another one turns out to be inducing any accident deficiency so if you avoid any accidents and are low and antioxidants than yo build up larger muscles but they won’t be stronger muscles interesting now with that be a would that be induced to be a diet so eating maybe you know a low antioxidant diet could actually promote hypertrophy but also poor health yeah that’s right well so intense exercise itself generates oxidative stress mmm so that will tend to deplete antioxidants and if you are already deficient in antioxidants begin with that can lead to tissue damage including muscle damage and especially heart damage is a risk but damaging your muscle can lead to larger muscles so if you’re thinking like a bodybuilder you think I have to get the biggest muscles sure in order to win the competition you’re going to need to do the health damaging methods as well as health improving that that’s gaining strength yeah we’ve certainly seen some bodybuilders with perhaps less than stellar lifespans as well yeah that’s right and when I did a blog post on this I put up a few YouTube videos you know showing bodybuilders who have died young you know even though they have very large muscles they’re not necessarily stronger than people with smaller muscles but we fell out a more helpful program right that extra size without any additional strength is an indicator that tissue damage and you know that the muscles aren’t really as functional as they should be hey man give me a lot to think about you don’t want gains just for the sake of gains everything’s a little bit more complicated than it might seem on the surface whether gaining weight losing weight or you know simply trying to live a healthy diet but I appreciate you coming on the show man it’s always something I look forward to I enjoy our conversations and hope to run into you at some point in the future maybe next year’s Berlin paleo convention yeah that would be great just want to mention you’re continuing to offer your perfect health retreats as well anything coming down the line for those that people should be excited about yeah well the next one up is October 10 through the 17th cool and we’ve got a really great staff on the training side we’re going to have a guest trainer cork wing who’s the head trainer at CrossFit New York City nice you know he’s trained some world champion martial artists and you know but he’s also created with anybody we’ve got a returning trainer Jay Chung who is great at mobility work and does one hour one-on-one sessions we’ve got a chain leading the cooking and she’ll teach home cooking everyone I do science classes and health coaching and we have a really well developed program that’s cool really good at making people feel better yeah gone through a few iterations at this point kind of get it dialed in yeah that’s right and also this year we’re doing gut microbiome sequencing and analysis good with you biome very class so it’s a really good program and it’s also in a luxury location on the beach in North Carolina at a great time of year with two heated salt water pools saltwater hot I you know and there’s time to relax and enjoy yourself as well nobody will be suffering no no one suffers awesome late ball thanks again for coming on the show man okay thank you does Paul jamming a of the perfect health diet can find out about Paul’s books as well as the perfect health diet retreat by going to his website perfect health diet calm coming up next Adam Ferrara and big picture paleo I’m Tony Federico and you’re listening to p.m. are hey everybody Tony here I’m with Adam froth on another segment of big picture paleo Adam what are we going to be talking about today in the big picture what’s going on Tony how’s it going good man yeah so you know I wanted to talk about something that I’ve been working on for you know very long time and it’s something that we all probably are going to work on for the rest of our lives which is the idea of self-improvement versus self-acceptance I’ve read a lot of self-improvement type books and I feel like at various points in my life it’s it’s been helpful for someone or something to kind of push me sort outside of my comfort zone and towards possibilities that I had closed off but then it also seems contradictory when you talk about self-improvement and and self-acceptance they seem to be at cross-purposes with each other yep on a lower level they are and it’s always a balancing act for us i think if you haven’t read the power of now by eckhart tolle a I think everybody should it’s an outstanding book and it actually takes this idea of self-acceptance and being present to the moment and accepting the moment as it is it takes that very Eastern concept that’s just beyond

foreign to us Westerners and it puts it into something we can understand and it shows us the importance of self-acceptance and it shows us that self-improvement and self-acceptance aren’t mutually exclusive how would you frame self-acceptance and self-improvement as may be complementary or as part of the same picture okay so when we especially those of us in the fitness community in the Paleo community whether we’re healthy and we want to be extraordinary whether we’re sick and we just want to get healthy again and then later we want to be extraordinary or however that comes into play i think that the fitness thing and the sort of these entrepreneurial things we get into and getting into paleo and wanting to do something about the environment and eat local and all this this is all very self improvement this is all very self improved a lot of every stuff yeah going on there yeah I mean I don’t think anybody picks up paleo magazine or finds their way to paleo because they’re satisfied with where they are I mean it just doesn’t happen I mean it’s nice when they find their way to paleo instead of you know eight minute abs or something but it’s still a self-improvement thing so what can happen though is we get so focused on where we want to go and where we aren’t now that we lose all presence to the moment we’re just running and pushing and striving and then of course that comes you know if you want to get hormonal about it there’s the adrenal system the cortisol thing so I guess the way I would encapsulate it is that you know if you think on the left side of the page you have self improvement on the right-hand side you have self-acceptance and right in the middle you have being present to the moment if that makes any sense and so we want to accept where we are and be present to the moment we also want to self improve but too much self improvement without enough self acceptance is detrimental but at the same time there’s a lot of things in our lives that can be improved I have a real hard time with that because I have these conversations with people and I’m saying well but you can change that that doesn’t have to be like that and it’s sort of like how far outside of your perspective you can get to say oh wait I don’t have to be sick you know it’s not just oh I’m going to self accept because I’m sick it’s like but wait you what if you could back up from that and not even be sick right while you’re sick accepting and say okay it might take me a year or two to fix this but I’m going to do it it might take me a year or two or three to take the hundred pounds off but that’s ok I’m going to accept where I am self improve self accept etc so what I’m hearing is that the challenge then is to hold both of those yes kind of simultaneously in your in your mind thinking about perhaps your past where you’ve been your current state but still having a willingness to look forward and to aspire to dream yet to think beyond your current circumstances and I would say that that seems to be really the razor blade you know that you’re walking along right there and because that’s the difficult thing to do and and the razor’s edge is now the razor’s edge is present in the moment one side is going to slip it off of right one side is self improvement one side is self acceptance but that razor edge is presents to the moment mmm and that’s totally wrote a whole book about it so that and that that’s it that’s the deal right there exactly and then as soon as you become aware of being in the president now you’re swiftly out of it as soon as you say oh look I’m present I did it I mean yeah you’re now your self congratulatory and in the past and the fumes already rushing towards you but yeah guys are kind of going back to the the fitness application of this idea I just wanted to kind of mention something that you know I’ve been in the fitness business for nearly a decade professionally and hits early interested in it longer than that and you know I think for me growing up with GI Joes and can and you know even Ninja Turtles they all have like six packs of the Ninja Turtles I mean seriously they have a six pack on their shell it’s yeah you know it doesn’t even make sense so there’s no muscle there why do they need a six-pack but right right the thing is it’s like hey you know for a long time I struggled because i’m not you know to be straightforward i’m not a six-pack guy any time i’ve gotten the outline of six pack you know even if i’m really low in my body fat it’s not super defined yep my face is gone people are asking me if I’m sick right no I’m certainly not happy I’m wink I’m not lifting nearly the amount of weight that I normally lift I’m not able to jump as high I’m not is strong and is capable in my body and then when I kind of lao myself to kind of come up to my natural wait the whisper of a six-pack disappears yep and then I feel good and it’s like man there’s this thing there’s like should I as a professional shouldn’t I be able to happy at six pack you know I kind of feel like there’s that pressure there and then there’s that self-acceptance I’d well actually I kind of feel good when I’m quote unquote softer and you

know am I just accepting that you so I can I can definitely relate to this little delicate balancing act and I think that um it’s just something that perhaps there’s no easy answer you know if somebody’s out there listening to this it’s something that we have to determine what what is that razor’s edge for ourself what is that blend of self-acceptance with self aspiration with self improvement and there’s no set thing that you can say like okay well this is the right mix you know it’s something that we have to kind of mix up and and determine for ourselves and it might even change kind of as a process of aging and whatever maturation we might experience yeah it totally changes I mean 10 15 years ago you know having a six-pack and being huge and all that stuff was like really important to me now I have other goals I mean I actually kind of still want to bring the six-pack in better and and get stronger but I mean for me it’s like well I’m gonna be 42 at the end of this month oh hey well happy birthday if I don’t I thank you yeah we might not talk till August so yeah you know for me it’s thinking well what am i doing you know now to set myself up for my 50s and for my 60s and my 70s and like what you know what kind of shape am I going to be in and what is it moving forward but I but see I’m a very intense hyper-aggressive self-improvement kind of guy I always have been and that’s not for everybody um you know other people you mean to me it doesn’t make sense but I’ve been more accepting of other people and is okay well if that’s all okay with you then that’s cool that’s you and then that’s all right because that’s what’s good for you but and that in and of itself is a form of self acceptance because you know we’re speaking to like you said a paleo community you know the people who are listening to this have come into this because they are probably like yourself and I would say I’m definitely more on this end of the spectrum as well that aggressive self improvement yeah you know to be that of that previous position it’s really hard to understand and to accept other people’s self acceptance which that’s a whole nother bag of worms right there man I think to really accept yourself I think if you do that you are more capable of understanding other people’s perspective because you’re like hey this is me I’m not going to impose that but I think if you’re still fundamentally uncomfortable with who you are and may write too far in that self-improvement spectrum and maybe getting a little single-minded and in a little yeah blinded to other people’s perspectives I think it’s easier to just be like well you don’t get it like you don’t care about yourself and almost you know get mad at people for not having the same aggressive determination to constantly improve but i think that there’s certainly some that can be gained from both sides of the equation yeah now i agree with you and it’s funny because actually you you know i talked to people and you know evangelize paleo a million percent less now than I did years and years ago I mean I don’t even talk about now if somebody approaches me and really needs help and they’re really they’ve done some homework and they’re like I really helped a woman out yesterday with her her son who was clinically depressed and and you know and I mean I did a lot with her but but that was somebody that had already said hey you know my son’s having this problem D is the chemicals in the sugar and the grains and stuff could that be causing his depression i’m like well yes and then we had a phone consult we had a long conversation everything else but if somebody had just said oh yeah you know my son has depression i wouldn’t start evangelizing paleo i’m not out to change people really i mean once they’ve decided they want to change i love to help but I’m not out there trying to change everybody and and you know evangelize the paleo thing I mean there’s other people that want to and that’s great for them and thank you because they can do that but I’ve just accepted that that we’re sort of where we are and if you’re really the self-improvement thing takes a lot of heart it’s sounding Z if you’re really going at it it’s not easy um when it’s not easy you do have to sort of except where you are but then always looking forward to where you want to go ultimately you know and may be asking yourself why are you constantly try to self improve what you write you know what are you running away from it’s so bad in that present moment um that’s scary but I think it’s certainly worth diving into both of those endeavors well Adam I think that we might have the subject for our next talk talking about perhaps paleo and Vangelis ‘um Wow JAMA how to or how not to paleo evangelize effectively that’ll be the next segment of big-picture paleo yeah Adam thanks man appreciate you coming on and sharing it with me today it’s always a pleasure alright you also mad thank you alright paleo nation that’s going to do it for today’s episode coming up next time on the podcast mito perec founder of OMG mutual and i get into the details of ghee making how he started his business and even shares the first time he tried beef something that was a little shocking to his Hindu family here’s a clip well one day we went out on a class trip and I

had a burger I remember asking everybody what it was and they’re like oh it’s a hamburger and you know where can I get this taste delicious and you know what is this magical thing it was a weird thing so one day we’re sitting at lunch and my mom puts everything out on a table I’m looking at it I’m like you know I don’t really feel like eating this here we go get a burger and everybody was just like what to hear the rest of mutual story you’re going to want to tune in to next week’s podcast to make sure that that happens subscribe to us on iTunes as well as favorite us on stitcher I’m Tony Federico and on behalf of everyone at paleo magazine thank you for listening if you would like to share your story on pmr please visit our facebook page at slash paleo magazine for full transcripts of the show as well as exclusive online content go to our webpage paleo mag online com you can also talk to us on twitter at hashtag p.m. radio