MCB4 October 2020 Chelsea Land Use Committee

meeting starts pam just make sure you look up your voting site because a lot of places have changed because of covid yes i’m aware of that and they had for early voting they were going to send me to madison square uh square garden to that site but for the actual day of voting it’s 20 it’s the sales matter that’s and and that’s that’s a public service announcement to everybody is just reconfirm your voting locations because a lot of places have changed this year because of covet there you go it’s true i will check again tracking your ballot paul that’s a question yeah again we’re not in the if we’re not launching the meeting yet we’re doing politics instead by my car business business so we only have one uh item on our agenda guys um maybe we can be speedy uh it’s the our budget request um and i i maybe i could sort of lead us off in that i look back at what people said at our last meeting when we talked a little bit about the budget uh if you bear with me i’ll just tell you what some people recommended we didn’t make an official form that we filled out yet but we had from kid a recommendation for a study to analyze the feasibility of repurposing empty buildings such as office and theaters to convert them to affordable housing we had a suggestion from virum well he a comment from viren that dcp is studying vacant housing due to people leaving the city and that architecture schools were looking at retrofitting various types of buildings and malls i don’t is viren on this uh meeting yeah he’s here okay um bert suggested reuse for health care um and then jesse raised who would do such studies and then i guess jesse or someone said dcp or edc now that we could write a letter on that if we wanted to have a collaborative planning effort and brad mentioned i may have gotten this little screwed up the need for state funding for infrastructure such as sump pump at fulton houses which would be a capital expense the other ones would be expense budget items and paul focused on four items general items security education housing and health and um i’ve been uh involved with the chelsea working group for the public housing and chelsea so this is not discussed at the last meeting i have on my mind funding for apartment renovations and other infrastructure improvements for those projects and then we have um covert 19 related opportunities to make budget requests i’ve i’ve got some ideas about that but rather than listen to myself maybe we could open the discussion on mainly expense budget items and covid 19 related items does anybody want to put their two cents in don’t all speak at once oh uh yeah actually i have a question betty it’s it’s interesting that you brought up fulton houses uh what uh as far as budget wise what are we allowed to try to budget for if i mean how does that fit into the whole process i’m just curious um i don’t know i can’t really answer that question i just know that there’s such a great need for funding of yeah we’ve been living for the last year gnashing our teeth and pulling our hair out to find ways that we can you know sell their rights and do all kinds of exotic things to generate funding so maybe jesse can contribute on that yeah can i jump in there so um hector that’s a great question so um historically we’ve you know we’ve done the board has really done their

um uh budget you know budgeting for getting budget information um by from two ways one from tenant associations right and literally just calling up the tenant associations for fulton elliot chelsea and harborview and saying what do you guys need you know in either capital you know uh or expense and we’ve listed those historically in our budget so it’s not listed in the cl it doesn’t usually come through land use it usually comes through housing so it’s not a it’s not necessarily something i listed here um that’s listed in when uh in your first but if you look at the overall document um you can see from last year we really did prioritize a number of the fulton and uh uh elliot chelsea and uh harborview requests because we were you know participating in the the chelsea uh uh you know the chelsea nycha working group so much and wanted to make sure that we were advocating and you know following through with what we what we’ve been saying in those meetings um so but it can be it’s usually all capital it’s usually all pretty large you know projects whether it be something as simple as when i say simple as it’s meaning in the grand scheme of capital projects of replacing front doors to you know um the lights in front of the uh the lights in front of um um else chelsea elliott uh on 20 you know on 26th street there uh to the cameras security cameras to boilers to roofs so um uh it almost it can be almost you know anything related we haven’t historically done anything in expense in terms of direct you know staffing of a certain type of you know a need a staffing need or anything along those lines um so can i yeah and also hector in a general response to your question and this is for the benefit of everybody and especially the newer people what we are is in the beginning of the budget process for the next upcoming fiscal year budget decisions so what we’re doing now is the very early stages of what are the budget priorities from our community district right and we’re taking a perspective from the land use committee are there things within the city budget that we think need to be beefed up whether it’s a ongoing expense or a capital expense and then that will go to a budget task force which will then get sifted out and then the entire community board will prioritize our budget needs for the upcoming fiscal year so it’s a we’re in the very we’re in the early stages of like a dream list kind of creation and as jesse and betty pointed out a lot of the stuff at nycha the capital expenses aren’t necessarily from land use but they they would probably come more from housing but if we can you know help get our thought train running with ideas of what we want for land use priorities okay so i i guess my my next question of the follow-up would be i guess i’m glad to hear we’re still in the beginning process of uh of uh thinking about what’s going to go into the budget requests proposals um at what point do we reach out i mean do we reach out to the tas of both of all the uh housing uh of open nycha locations or you know yeah that’s on my list to do so i historically done that i just reached out to um um darlene right and darlene and i produce a report you know i i don’t want to call it a report it’s not it doesn’t it doesn’t suffice as a report it’s a piece of paper that says this is what they report this is what they said that they need and i and i provide that to the uh um you know to the housing task force i’m not the housing tax i’m sorry the budget task force um uh you know it it’s always been a little i will say hector actually this is something that this is not necessarily something that clue this is clue focus but i do think getting more input from nycha residents and from nycha itself earlier on in the process has has always been i think a struggle for us um and so it sort of has fall upon falling into this mic had my responsibility of just sort of getting the you know getting having a phone call with the ta presidents but i think if there’s some way to include it more into the housing conversation earlier on you know i think that would be something to have i think that’d be helpful and so maybe we can follow up with maria and maybe the tas and joe and have a conversation about how we can sort of make that a yearly thing because

it just doesn’t unfortunately um that sounds great um i i guess i i’d like to help along with the process because obviously i have a stake in both billy chelsea and fulton so um and i kind of know all the players involved so if anything you know anything i could do i’d be more than happy to facilitate get this you know get the ball rolling on some of this stuff oh sorry did you want to say something you looked like you were about to say something well i was going to then i was going to do the same because we do have three members of the chelsea languages committee on the nature working group i don’t see your hand sorry mike’s hand is up i see it i don’t see it so yeah so the pers mike i want that’s perfect because i wanted to think if the nycha working group has any land use perspective items that are coming out that maybe housing will address something on the budget priority from the nitro working group but we as lane juice perspective is there anything that we need to address michael did you want to say something well i i did you know and i i can say that you know just as in the past we really haven’t ever had anything strictly from milani’s perspective to comment on but we did uh add stuff to the to the budget the capital request we’ll know so one of them this year that i think we cannot uh you know stop asking for is you know to to redo the elevators in this building and elliott uh buildings elevators are catastrophe here every now and then you know we got people that are disabled can’t use the elevators as on and off it’s all the time on and off you know so that’s one thing we should you know do again about it suppose suppose we put as sort of a holding spot or a till until jesse pulls the the tenant leaders improve funding for improvement of infrastructure for for the public housing projects particularly redoing the elevators plus other um other parts of the projects that based on tenant feedback you know that jesse will will get could we make some sort of general statement like that would that be kosher would it be more impactful if we just focused on elevator maintenance and repair that’s probably the single biggest budget expense that any any building faces aside from a boiler replacement or a roof replacement elevator maintenance is is the priciest thing on the on the book that well we i do know i do know from the conversations of the working group that the heating system and hector and elzora you can correct me that the heating system would need to be replaced am i in which building we’re talking about all and all of them actually that’s it’s a major major issue so so because elevators and heating systems that’s basically the guts of your building yeah it’s a huge expense it’s a big expense yeah so if we bulleted and everybody in different committees all said you know do the elevators get get funding for your elevators and do the elevators i guess the funding for elevators let me just say something full disclosure employees of the housing authority are my clients many of them are but the elevator maintenance people and for example it’s also an expense item because there are like right now um 45 i think something like 45 or 46 unfunded elevator helper positions the housing authority is not filling those positions and using laborers using laborers to help the elevator mechanics which is completely unsafe it’s a nightmare it’s a nightmare so if we’re talking elevators there’s capital but there’s also expense items

and they’re not even using the expense what they’re budgeted to use they’re not using it for whatever reason so how does that affect what what decisions we make about what well i don’t celebrate a maintenance and i think part of that is um the staff that the housing authority is using to maintain the elevators how do we impact that yes that’s what we want to do i mean we’re talking budget here that’s in the expense budget one to use all the positions that they have already in the budget which they’re not using not and to use trained people in that elevator maintenance department not laborers which they have to to use the labor is they have to do a very quick couple of weeks training for the laborers to know which is the door and which is top and which is the bottom of the elevator um wow that you really you really know this bert well they’re my clients is that is that is there data that tells you which of the positions are not filled i have just i just haven’t today came across something from the union about that with the elevated maintenance helpers so it sounds like we could we could uh fine-tune this recommendation what do you think paul yeah i think i think putting it both in capital and in uh ongoing expenses okay so we’ll just we can do that both and um bert you’ve given us some valuable information is is is there anything that you have in writing that you could share it with us that we could make a meaningful statement i’ll get numbers that from what i saw the this afternoon and i’ll email it to you okay you’re familiar with the language that we need in these forms anyway so that’d be great jesse has something to add though yeah i i just two things that i just wanted one just a little bit clarify what paul had said earlier that at the beginning of the process it is at the beginning of the process in the sense of like we’re talking about fy22 and we have just we’re just in the beginning of fy21 but in terms of our actual process we’re voting on these recommendations in november’s full board so we’ve had the last two months to negotiate talk about these uh uh from a committee perspective each committees have been discussing them in their own different fashion and so what you’re voting on tonight is what you’re recommending to the budget task force now bert knows you know and uh uh i’m quickly checking around the room i don’t think anybody else on this call but bert knows for sure right that then the budget task force’s job is to try to combine all of these yeah and juggle them so i just don’t want to give people to though i don’t want to give people the impression that i tonight we will be you will be voting on it so um and then the other thing is i just it’s your prerogative of course this committee as as as a committee but i just want to you know historically uh the what you’re what you’re what you’re voting on as recommend or budget requests have been things that the committee itself has been on record for you know you know working on and you know you know either sent the previous letter about or or has had a discussion about it so i i i’m just raising that as things that if we’re bringing in new information necessarily not to say that it doesn’t require a priority i’m just saying that you know you have existing stuff that you voted that you’ve been recommending for years on that that are on your list that you i think at some point tonight you should go through and decide whether you know what where that all falls out if it if it’s still relevant if it’s not relevant however you feel about it but i just want to yeah yeah that’s that’s interesting jesse because i’ve been thinking about it today and talking to paul that i think a number of the things that i looked at them again and for the third time like things about zoning and code enforcement and all that kind of stuff i personally think that at this point in the city’s uh economic situation that those things don’t feel to me to be high priority those ones that we’ve had on our list you know for a long time and that we may want to try to generate some new recommendations more relevant to our situation in the city i don’t know how everybody else feels but i just feel that you know

expanding a zoning district or upping code enforcement will not be i think that that those kinds of items would be very low priority in this city and that there may be other things given coven 19 and the economic downturn that would be more relevant so um they’re in digital agreement you know as far as priorities go i mean uh it’s quality of life issues that we really should be addressing at this point and i think uh yeah we should introduce some new uh ideas on this budget if we can at this point i don’t know and maybe it’s late in the game but uh i don’t know what the process might be but uh that might be something we maybe seriously consider i i was gonna ask veron um i kind of today was awfully late noticed i send you an email but um that you had been talking at the last meeting about retrofitting or converting buildings that are underused or empty into other land uses which i thought i thought is very relevant at this point or it could be relevant and that we could request funding for certain studies along those lines and you’d think that maybe architecture schools are looking at that already architectural schools i’m looking at that actually even before kowitt’s truck uh for a variety of reasons so new york city is known to have pretty high um what you call it um vacancy rate irrespective of what happens the pandemic but because the pandemic i think the vacancy rate uh in housing apartments is 13.8 now and that’s the data that actually is generally collected by hpd uh and real estate um you know brokerage companies uh so that number does exist and that’s sort of fairly accurate um for office buildings the vacancy is not high but the buildings are empty the office spaces are empty because only ten percent of the workforce is actually showing up to work so that’s the finding that for of my students that actually reached out to a number of different um property owners which we have large diamonds so no time no large scannings have left any of these office spaces so to speak and paul can probably um you know qualify my statement a bit more and they haven’t left but they’re not being used for me so that’s where we are so there is a there’s emptiness which is not considered to be vacancy that’s the distinction that they’re making housing vacancy is real and um ranks are falling israel um so that sort of you know is sort of known even uh new york times wrote an article about it and going back to the schools looking at vacant buildings and adaptive reuse that’s been going on for last couple of years mainly because across the board there is a pretty large percentage of old buildings that are not exactly conducive to any kind of particular use right away unless you retrofit them so schools are looking at those kind of buildings then last but not the least you might have read about industry city proposals being pulled back meaning they withdrew that because it wasn’t going to be approved there was a big community push back and in the process um the whole project would actually be drawn not um rejected if it’s withdrawn but that’s an important fact to know because while we say that could you just uh pause for a second um what was withdrawn things at park uh the industry series was three buildings three or four buildings that were to be converted for rapid reuse and you know all kinds of cool stuff was going to come up there offices um incubators um sort of what do you call them startups um food uh kind of uh places food production places actually uh restaurants and water very large ambitious project that was supposed to kind of bring the economic um change to the to the community um but there was a pushback because of its perceived um what do you call it threat for gentrification which has happened in williamsburg it is happening in the brooklyn navy yards and around there i mean the fact that the wag man shows up next to brooklyn navy yards tells its story so the community had a major pushback that’s the project that’s been withdrawn the developer

withdrew that proposal that was sitting in front of philly planning well i mean i guess the question would be would we want to make a recommendation for some kind of funding which would be an expense item for some kind of study along the lines of what we’re talking about and so you know could be dcp edc uh dhs hpd some collaborative effort because it seems there’s i mean we we’re just a group of people we don’t know exactly what’s going on you know we just sort of know what’s going on and would that be a meaningful request it could be for office spaces i’m not sure yet because there isn’t enough data to suggest that it’s warranted it it would be probably it is probably happening for smaller office spaces river is a very um particular um circumstance i mean that their situation is entirely different compared to the large sort of um lease and the companies at least large spaces for example you know post office is being released by facebook now i don’t know who’s going to actually work there but they’re actually at least leasing that space so though it is empty it is not considered to be vacant i’m just giving you a very jarring example in our own neighborhood right there are there is though in a lot of the large corporations you know i don’t know exactly who but there’s a lot of sublease space now coming on the market which means the large company is not giving up their space but they’re trying to see people see if they can sublease a part of the space this is only recently in the last month or two months it’s now been you know on the market and i only know this because not that i’m a broker but i read it in the times no it is true i think people are doing that people are retrofitting existing spaces to reduce the number of people who can actually occupy those pieces so they you know the reduction is so that kind of planning is happening but if you ask me technically speaking does that qualify as vacancy rate no for offices for um housing related we could request that kind of a study through hpd because they are actually the keepers of you know how the vacancy and because that affects their um sort of what do you call it their mandate in terms of um brand stabilization and land control issues edc would come into play when we talk about industry city or some other large um you know spaces that are being converted so edc might be potentially an agency that could help us understand the issue of office space vacancy but there’s no ct agency that’s keeping that because they’re basically saying that’s all commercial that’s not our problem and hey what word would you use instead of because i should point out it’s not technically a vacancy what’s another word we could use there um the buildings are empty they use the word emptiness they call them empty buildings just empty empty spaces yes empty spaces yeah what they say sorry i’m just going to qualify that little more they say only 10 of the leased spaces are occupied right right so it’s not technically a vacancy because the the companies are still paying the rent or the lease but there’s emptiness so that’s that i want to make sure we’re clear on that distinction not giving up the space they are we’ll be coming back there was something in today’s paper next july is the uh yeah i read that next july will be the new january but the question is not that they’re not going to come back will still be chase is putting up a whole new building on park avenue complete new headquarters the question is how are they going to use the building net when it’s finished differently than when they planned it originally pre-pandemic now how are these companies coming back how will they be using this space post-pandemic as opposed to pre-pandemic they might be not as many people in the offices the square footage may be the same but the number of people will be different which then will affect the the the the subsidy not the um what’s the word the other like the retail around the corner and the lunch spaces because the local the local businesses there would be less

people you mean it reverberates yeah it sounds to me like maybe if we wanted to go down this road that we might recommend two different kinds of study one about residential um issues and one about um industrial commercial office building uses so different seems like they’re apples and oranges if that’s where if we want to go down that kind of a route they’re two different things and i i agree with you betty as a as an advisory group our focus seems to be generally speaking housing much more than office space by and large i’m just saying as a community that’s what we sort of concern ourselves with um the discussion that we had last month was potentially converting office spaces into residential we’re not there yet and that’s the sort of reading that i get nobody’s there yet there’s a there’s a request for five percent reduction of the large leased spaces but there’s no whole cell walking away or vacating those from isis so that’s where the distinction needs to be made so there’s no way we can discuss converting office spaces into affordable housing because that point is at least about i would say in my opinion personally it’s at least about a year away from today so maybe next october november there might be his budget is done too um hey brad did i see your hand go up yeah i’m just trying to wrap my hands around what somebody said originally was we understand where the city’s finances are this is something we talked about on the other board i was on with the parks and i’m kind of with our chair co-chair of let’s aim small shoot small right i mean i think we should be very specific we’re asking for a big study we’re not getting we’re not going to get any of this this is a pie in the sky they’re not going to spend money on doing a study scott stringer’s office has done one the um manhattan borough president has turned out studies after studies of what they’re going to do with the open uh retail the open office space you know um last week we were presented on a big board of all the incentives that scott stringer’s office is trying to do to help them get money to reuse these spaces i just i i don’t know i i just think maybe we could really just focus on one or two items it’s just my opinion i think that’s all great things to say but you know unless they do it for free which we could advocate through our office but i just don’t think sending this to the city right now in any shape or form is even going to get looked at in my opinion that’s a good point are there some specific items that you would recommend bert brad brad no i i just i yeah sure um bursts right above you in the box yeah i i i’m all for being very specific about affordable housing that we have now and letting people get on an elevator i think mechanically you know doing mechanical upgrades that’s a whole other wax that i don’t think we’re involved with but to say to the city let’s put some money towards having maintenance on an elevator i think is a realistic ass because it’s safety i mean i i have no problem with that one i think we got that i agree with brad i really really agree with brad on that that we should stay focused on what we are best known for which is our search for affordable housing and as far as i’m concerned safety in elevators i don’t know how many elevators there are in fulton houses it’s a number i’d like to know um but that’s something that we could definitely focus on and have some impact and then the second one which i would say is which i happen to enjoy is we do approve these um sidewalk cafe so i’m for looking at obviously we want to say we want them to help the businesses but i like the idea going forward more permanent i think it adds a lot to the city my opinion so i don’t know if we want to weigh in on something like that i know they just announced that they could have their heaters and the rest of it but maybe we should say as a community we are advocating for them taking the side with space

and maybe taking some street space just thought that coming up with transportation um community which i’m sort of part of so i can tell you that that’s actually being taken up and i think one more suggestion which is sort of right now floating not sort of put in place yet is that city also should gain something from it so it’s not because you actually are creating different types of conflicts so when the public space is being used for private gain what does city get out of it and what does the community get out of it besides well i think i think one i just it killed me at the last meeting when our representatives sat there and said their answer to everything is more tax i i just i i don’t know where they’re thinking of where this money just happens to come and people that make that top extra larger money they’re leaving you can’t it’s just it’s it’s crazy to me we’re gaining what we’re gaining is people working and our neighborhood is gaining skills they have somewhere to go i mean that’s just how i see what we’re gaining we’re also gaining some some city life that we haven’t seen in a long time of a chase and a rite aid on every corner we’re starting to to me to see a bit more community that we didn’t have before as a positive thing yeah um that’s just you know that’s how i see it i think that’s what we’re gaining we’re gaining our communities back we’re gaining shutting streets off we should and i understand transportation has it in their agenda but we’re the ones that are prove it yeah so now there’s a couple of good things there also you know some places in chelsea particularly um even in health kitchen actually the sidewalks need to be expanded you know now is the time to reclaim piece of the city that we can actually you know make permanent so now i mean there are a lot of good ideas on the table and it doesn’t matter which committee does it but as a community board i think a kind of clear agenda as to how we want the street space reshaped moving forward so there’s more room for the pedestrians and more amenities for the community including outdoor dining and whatever else that follows absolutely i think that’s that’s where we are i think we are in a very good place irrespective of the all the terrible things that we’ve seen there is a real understanding of how communities can reclaim the city and that can be done because i lived i grew up in chicago where they give permits based on where you live for a five block radius around your house that eliminated all the other parking problems they had and it really reduced this and forced people into outer boroughs or taking the train or parking in jersey all right you know that’s that’s certainly a transportation committee issue yes it is let’s let’s try to let’s try to refocus here guys um one quick thing paul before we move away from who does what kind of study i believe stringer’s office actually typically looks at retail vacancy issues more than any other city agency and that i forgot to mention before we could probably just simply could be a matter of writing a letter to um staying at the office they typically do that um every couple of years and i’m sure they’re working on it i just don’t have a way of knowing so we can inquire that is there something to be done but i also think varun the important thing for us is the the difference between vacancy and emptiness yeah because vacancy reports aren’t going to address the land use issues that we’re trying to tackle um so as burke points out you know less residents in i mean less occupants of these large office buildings a lower percentage because people will need more space inside of them post covid um means less people on the streets less impact a greater impact on local retailers so um then i had to correct you one more time um less people in the offices means people you’re giving you’re incentivizing people to move out of the city as well so they’re the kind of it’s a it’s a circular loop i mean you know you know what i’m trying to say so it is that already prompting people to leave the city because there’s no reason for them to come here all right so yeah exactly um and i think as brad points out we are i mean we’re seeing more community now i know that when i walk around chelsea and hell’s kitchen and i pass by the sidewalk cafes it ain’t a bunch of people from nebraska anymore it’s people from new york who are out on the streets um so let’s uh betty do you want to recap then what we’re going to actually vote on well i don’t know if we’re already i don’t know if we’re ready to do that i mean i think we have gotten two solid things um one one is

uh funding for the repair of elevators in our public housing projects and uh the correct and appropriate staffing of filling the spaces the slots for the positions for skilled elevator staff or engineers engineers so that’s one one thing and if we follow up on brad’s idea uh funding i guess i guess fi i i guess i mean we have to always talk about money because it’s a budget so funding to support sidewalk cafes um and uh that’s that’s that’s as far as i could get um and it seemed that i don’t know whether we have a consensus about asking for money for studies maybe that’s unrealistic and we shouldn’t do that i have one tiny uh item to bring up having to do with open streets which is budgeting for the expenses uh that are presently being born by individuals and the block associations to maintain the barriers replace them when they get wrecked and purchase the signage that’s needed to mount on those barriers is that something veron is that something sounds like transportation is tackling i know that when i was on that committee we talked about that a lot yeah i think it’s going to be one of those budgeting cam i think that’s a transportation issue i’ll make it okay i really wanted to take it to them if it’s not that we could i mean look we could like that i mean to be introduced it’s all going to get smushed together by the by the budget committee i mean i i feel uh attached to that item pam because i’m in a church responsible for thompson street in the village and yeah you know you’re aware that it is not without cost to to maintain yes i have 22nd street between 7th and 8th and my in my block association which is an open street and has been for several months we’ve spent beyond 250 bucks just to equip the the the barriers to get the barriers the appropriate barriers not the big wooden jobs um and also the signage it’s going to become an issue of manpower to set up the barriers and in the mornings and remove them in the evenings because we can’t hope to rely on our local citizens to step forward voluntarily and do that presently we we have that and we’re okay but it can’t last and that needs to be considered as well that’s sort of that was part of the selling point of the open streets though is that the the bids and the residents would take care of it that’s how it got through the process it’s okay those guys get paid for what they do no but it was bids it was bids and block associations both and i see your point that if we can get city funding for that it would be better to make that request it would be more reliable for sure well it’s not just bids i mean you know a church any black association are in much different financial consideration exactly um i mean if we want this whole whole concept to be successful it needs to be reliable so anyway i particularly like that i’m thank you thank you you know even if it is a transportation issue you know it’s land use in the sense that we the citizens are using these these spaces and we want them to be successful and it’s a land it’s actually a land use and that it’s taking taking property and using it in a different way yeah and and it the the impact is on the quality of life which is something we can certainly address so very creative i think how about some other ideas any other ideas um so i do want to also point out that um uh i have another idea if you want ideas i got a lot of ideas i think where are you a lot of times we are an island we should think dutch we should be thinking land use is water we should be utilizing our waterfront not just for a beautiful park we need to be it could be a floating

farm we need to be thinking about land use out towards the water it’s just my opinion i thought you were i thought you were not going to get it there to pandemic maybe we could use a farm or a floating hotel that could help the homeless something i thought you were going to talk about a building code that would allow for drone deliveries brad brad come to my come to my studio if you really want to talk about floating farms i love the floridan farms my studio is looking at ps76 believe it or not no idea we brought it up at the other meeting but but to me that’s still a land use issue it is it is it is and if we and you know i’m conflicted with the notion of um putting forward these priorities um and also having budget constraints and being realistic abroad as you recognize um floating farms and floating homeless shelters is a grand scheme i think in when we have a stronger budget let’s let’s talk about that on the other side of it um i have been talked to by a number of people that when we talk about budget priorities um last meeting i said let’s just wipe them all out and i was told that if we don’t keep our priorities in place from previous years they won’t be right you know it’ll be hard to get them back in again in future years so to keep our the other things that were in the budget request from last year such as code enforcement issues building department building issues land use on neighborhood needs things like that then we keep them in there but we recognize they’re not going to be a high priority placeholders exactly um so um brad let’s talk about uh water farms next year yeah okay i mean we could we could i mean it’s all on our list we can you know put him back keep keep on going i guess can i bring up more yeah one more issue it’s housing related and it’s been sort of you know tossed around quite a lot um we had a building on uh west 18th street residential building that was supposed to be mass timber supposed to be what mass timber it was a similar construction timber frame um high rise and that was basically pulled out because city will not approve it and all of that is happening city is now a little more sympathetic to it so i’m not going to get into that particular project alone but decarbonization in our community should be take taken into account when we actually have when we start looking at new proposals and new buildings we keep doing steel frame and concrete buildings all the time because that’s how the industry is set up but encouraging alternative materials such as mass timber there are many others should be something that we should be able to have a sale um and um you know this community actually has i mean this came up came to my mind when we were actually looking at terminal straws you know the timber frame building and then we putting steel thing on top of it and the justification was mainly because city will not approve um timber construction from far code point of view but mass timber actually does deal with far code as well and david can actually sort of testify to that as well so i think we should try and i’m not saying that we should make the entire neighborhood timber frame but for newer projects coming up decarbonization should be put on the agenda sustainability should be put on the agenda water harvesting should be put on the agenda uh solar panels should be put on the agenda geothermal should be put on the agenda these are the things but i mean we’re still talking about we we’re using 20th century tools and we are 20 years into 21st century so i think some of these items need to be sort of woven into how our approval processes are shaped moving forward i don’t know how we do it but there should be some mechanism in place well we’re talking about the budget right now so is there a way for what you want to be described as a budget ask questions well one way would be the big new development the the building codes would this be a little bit yeah i was gonna say if if there’s a europe where you know they’re trying to change or up zone that could be something that we could say could there be put money in the budget to have a category for sustainable material or our big one environmental is what

they’re doing with the garbage and you know i don’t think that’s uh uh i think it’s a pretty good idea but for budget wise we could say can we get some money in this city planning to add it in into their application just one idea because you’re not going to get it on a a townhouse renovation you’re going to get it out of something like hudson yards right yeah so it’s going to be on a bigger scale yeah i don’t know i don’t know which budget item it would certainly i don’t know the line item how what how we can describe it but sustainability guidelines um and how they actually get woven into city’s approval process maybe there’s something that we can ask dob and dcp to come up with jointly because one makes uh sort of you know one um sort of makes the regulation the other one enforces it so the two agencies should probably come together and find a way of making sure these things happen my understanding is that for that 18th street mass timber building it was to be where la luncha net was uh that the city was working with the developer on that and you know was open to accepting it and looking at ways that uh the timber framing could meet the equivalent of the building code and i know they got a good ways down the road with it and i think at some point the developer just decided it was too complicated and backed out i don’t think it was reluctance on the part of the city at that time no no i i didn’t i didn’t say that i would think that they pulled it out they they pulled out of the whole team going back to uh bert’s point about the budget issues um i think you’re raising a very valid point a very valid concern and maybe what we do is uh try to tackle it at one of our meetings and come up with a letter to the appropriate agencies to change policy right directly instead of having to be a part of a budget discussion let’s have a policy discussion about it no i agree with you paul i think that’s what other parties said i don’t know which line it fits into but it’s a discussion that we can have in the conversation with our next meeting or something yeah i think that let’s let’s do that let’s take that approach on that one let’s try to set let’s try to figure out a letter we want to write to the appropriate agency to work at policy change to improve sustainability and bring us into the 21st century in our construction engineering projects so i have a suggestion on a practical level because i’m practical minded what if we um uh approach the concept of having a study i know we’re not talking about spending money on studies but this one would be very sensible of in chelsea uh and this research should be doable uh all of the buildings that burn fossil fuel either oil number four or number two oil or or natural gas for heating for their heating systems and find and do a study about how many of those boilers uh what their ages are when they when they’re reaching the end of their age of their usefulness at about 40 years or 50 years some of them last that long that there should be some way to require the building owners to replace those devices with sustainable heating systems that would be a study worth worth doing then then you could have real impact on the sustainability in the future going forward either converting to electricity or geothermal or solar or a combination of all those things uh it’s worth worth talking about to the to buren’s point about sustainability yeah again this that’s not really a budget issue for us this week it would be if it was to finance if you were asking for the financing of a study to give us the information we would need okay i can i can frame any policy discussion as a study and get money there you go it’s just i know it’s just but let’s try that let’s try to like hone in a little bit here on our capital and expense line items for fiscal year 2022 and what we can get accomplished as okay and i think these are healthy conversations i have and we should have an agenda item at a meeting to talk about how we can tackle sustainability in the city and figure out ways to do that um i don’t think this is the right format for that okay it is very interesting pam yeah i love it and listen i i i can go off on that but i’m not going to because i’m asking other people why don’t we why don’t we just go back to um the placeholder concept and it seemed to me that code enforcement expanding

and reinforcing code enforcement and dob enforcement particularly for our our special districts and in our special districts um are a focus for keeping the placeholders so let me ask this everybody got the dropbox link to the spreadsheet that lists last year’s spending priorities right jesse yesterday yeah so i mean if we just want to agree as a committee we’ll just leave any ongoing budget line items in there as placeholders um can we have an agreement yes or no on that so those in favor of keeping all last year’s placeholders in place jessie’s just we’ve got a point caveat to that is that you as reported by the agency i am not saying that you know uh the problem is solved but you did get something funded last year so uh one of the one of the expense items was listed as being funded so i would just say if that’s okay we can either move to continued support level which is sort of a rank below or just remove it completely and saying thank you we’re yes we’re done i would i would i’d agree with that is everybody else there’s now just just if you look at if you look at the chart you’ll see that for instance code enforcement has specific topics of code enforcement so one has to do with dedicated inspector for special district enforcement and they the answer was the agency agrees with this request will accommodate in part um another one was code enforcement additional funding for buildings department enforcement inspectors for non-compliant ada entrances and says the department has increased the number of inspectors citywide um that’s just you know and then there’s a number of other other ones um now here’s a study so we could skip since we can but betty you you and i if the committee’s in agreement that we’re going to keep the budget priorities from last year and as jesse points out anything that is um continued funding will leave on anything else we can take up we’ll just clean up the actual list as long as it agrees that we keep those placeholders in place that’s our first but do we but do we do we keep in place things like modify the special permit process of wall street parking that’s of a different nature do we want to keep that in i think that the committee just said anything that was in previous years as a placeholder that needs we we’re just going to recognize it’s a placeholder it’s going to be a low priority but we’re going to keep everything in from last year that wasn’t funded or isn’t continuing you know like as jesse pointed out we’ll clean out the list but everything else says i think betty you said you’d had meetings with dcp and they were amenable to doing that this has to do with the luxury high rises going in along the high line where they you know they asked to exceed the 20 uh parking spaces too you know how long ago we had a meeting with dcp about that i i couldn’t even tell you how long ago yeah no we tried this year at the beginning of the year david to try to actually because every year they go we want to talk to you about this please follow up and you know and it always gets sort of pushed to the back because there’s always a euler that pops up or something else pops up and so this at the end of 2019 and through into the beginning of 2020 i actually was chasing down dcp to follow up on this issue because there’s ice they’re still not doing what we want them to do basically and uh well it’s still a valid issue i think we should leave it on there i agree with you because i don’t think we’re just actually where i just think like what paul said i think is we’ll we have to recognize that whatever i think you guys are discussing right now the top priorities to the one two three the things that you want to send to the budget task force to say this is the most important last year’s priorities are still important but we recognize that those are all going to sort of be shifted down and you know i have to say with regard to brad’s suggestion about use of the streets for restaurants uh that’s topical because it’s a demonstration project you know sometimes the city will do things like close streets like they do park avenue in the summer on weekends to give people a glimpse of what it

would be like if people could pedestrians and cyclists could take back the streets we have that happening by accident on a huge scale now so you know i think uh it’s good to strike while the iron is hot in this case so to me even though it seems more quality of life than something uh urgent uh in terms of looking ahead to the long term and making it a permanent sort of thing uh you know it’s this is the time to do it simply because of uh practical reasons so so we have two new things as i as i see it well the we’ve got the restaurants the outdoor dining okay um and we’ve got we’ve got uh the elevators okay we’ve got the outdoor dining and we’ve got the elevators at fulton and chelsea elliott um and we don’t want to do to propose studies um and i think and betty what i would suggest we do to pull in pam’s point about open street funding for the citywide level is on the restaurants a lot of them also happen to be on open streets so let’s find a way of incorporating the language together do you think it should be combined i mean i think it’s a more logical way of getting the funding for that is to put it in with the small business appeal because a lot of these like i know a lot of the streets that have restaurants are pretty much closed off to cars now not not all of them but there’s some and that’s a good way to get about tying these together okay i guess we could we could i think it’s a little apples and oranges but um i guess we could do it that way so we have two and a half new new things that we would say are we are we happy with that list of new things do we know no other new things that that want to be brought up so i guess that’s it then we we have these these these two and a half and then we’ve got recycling our old proposals are we are we good on that yeah sounds right yeah that’s what we that seems like we’ve arrived at with consensus uh jesse are we are we on the right path yeah so as long as you and paul work on the together afterwards and submit something to the budget task force that it clarifies those the ranking right of what they are who you want what agency you’re expecting the request to go to and if it’s a whether it’s capital or expense it’s that’s fine that’s that’s completely fine and and we have to do we have to use table one table two and table three i think it’d be easier for you guys for that because you can just add your new i’m assuming the two and a half will be the first three right priorities one two and three and then the others will just you’ll just rank roll down roll down uh or turn them into continued support or or just say remove because it’s been funded whichever one you want to do um okay and so then that’s fine and i think it sounds like what you guys done is actually combined table two and three into sort of our top priority ones that we just talked about yeah are related to the pandemic right and i’ll just say one other thing i think there’s nothing i think you don’t necessarily committees have tried very hard not to sort of like go into the scope of another committee in terms of recommendations but that doesn’t mean you guys can’t or the co-chairs of this committee or maybe maybe through bert at the budget task force say that they we recognize there’s these issues that are sort of go beyond what our normal sphere is and we think these are really important so we’re going to back up you know the transportation related things or the or the you know i will say a lot of the street stuff just so we’re all clear i mean uh but they all go in front of actually more in front of blp you know like a lot of the the the future you know the you know they used to go all the restaurant stuff goes in front of blp and so just um you know i think that’s that’s that’s something to be be aware of as well so but yeah that’s fine so as long as you guys vote and you’re all contingent of the can you i apologize just because it was a what would the two the the two and a half things are again betty the outdoor dining uh for restaurants uh the city streets which could be a subset of that or separate call that open streets i mean open streets sorry that’s what i meant and the uh repair of

elevators in the public housing projects which would include uh staffing up with appropriate uh engineers and and filling the lines that need to be filled yeah there’ll be two requests there one capital improvement and one um operating expense right okay you know when there was just so i understand and i i don’t want to start us off i mean i apologize if this opens up a whole nother can of worm but are we prioritizing in that way are you saying does that matter to the budget task force put the elevators first well the elevators are everybody everybody in favor of elevators first raise your hand there we go all right elevators will perform restaurants and dining great and we i would just ask if we want to include boilers and roofs in that though because you know when it was written about in the new york times what bad shape fulton house was was in you know those were mentioned as well as major problems these are the three sort of major ticket items you got elevators you’ve got boilers and you’ve got the roofs these are the three items that are killing nature yeah so it’s basically everything except for the brick which is the last not last night not to mention jessie hot and cold water lines and the risers jesse can i answer can i can i ask jesse or alzora betty is is the nycha working group putting together a budget request as part of our community board budget process no i don’t think so so it does have to come through housing and us and whatnot okay all right now just so just just so i i i i i just want to create what usually happens here is that things like the roofs and the boilers and the and the elevators and i’m and i’m not i am not from uh uh defending nycha all here at this point but that’s their big ticket items you’re all right about it and that’s where they that’s what their folk that’s what they tell us that they’re focused on fixing right so then one what every year that’s why we go to the tas because if we say the boilers and the the roofs and the elevators their response is going to say yeah we’re working on it right and so i that one of the reasons why we historically have gone to the tenant associations is because there’s other things there’s other quality of life and public safety things that don’t get that sort of get pushed to the bottom or ignored by nycha that we do so i just don’t want to i just want to be prepared that there there will be a sort of if you look at what nycha or nitro requests are in the past even last year you know there were things like front doors cameras um you know new lobbies those types of things those are the things that the ta had communicated to us so i’m i’m not stop i don’t want i’m not trying to get involved i’m not trying to impede this conversation and say that the items that you guys discussed aren’t important but i just wanted to be aware that there’ll be another set of information coming in from the tas that will most likely say yes those are obviously all big ones but we know nycha is already going to be focusing on those what we want to advocate for is you know the lights in front of our playground that aren’t being paid attention to or the you know the things that haven’t been the you know the trash compactor doors that haven’t been um hector has his hand up so i’ll defer i mean t.a person to tell me if i’m wrong or not yeah i’m like mike mike mike or yeah actually uh no that’s a that’s a really good point jesse i mean um you know i the type of strengths i mean i was a little confused as to i guess the budget timing that we have here i mean are we having this is the preliminary discussions or we’re about to vote tonight for the budget items that we’re going to put in today because honestly because if i had if we had the time i would go back to the taa and uh both uh houses and asked them you know what would you like you know maybe the top five i get out of the top five we can all have a later discussion on it but if time is uh an issue here then obviously we would have to go with you know the top three which is really the heat uh elevators just to clarify i’m gonna the budget task force is meeting on thursday yeah so i usually reach out this week to to get in you know either to check in with all of the ta presidents to say this is what you requested last year is this still the same request do you want something new or has things progressed for example i know there’s certain things that darlene has let me know have progressed you know and so we have moved if you notice how we did it last year with the with some of the

chelsea elliott requests we made them actually continued support because things have been began to move on some of the issues that she had raised to us um and so we let’s how about you and me talk tomorrow if that’s all right um yeah yeah because i don’t want to drag this out i i do understand that you’ve already got a process and so but again i think it speaks to a broader conversation about how we can get nycha more inclusive or how we can be more inclusive with nycha going forward with our budget because it’s always been a bit of a kind of last minute type of quick call kind of thing rather than a you know maybe a more thorough conversation i would just like to clarify something because earlier we said we wanted to be very focused and specific so we talked about the elevators and now it’s being suggested that we add the boilers and the roofs so i’m not sure if that direction is the way we want to go because those those are like very very very big items and i thought we wanted to do some wanted to suggest something that was very doable well let me chime in on something here okay the reason why i left my comments only uh with respect to elevators is because of things like uh you know boilers you know the heat hot water uh the roof facades you know pointing up brick those things are already being handled because there’s an agreement with the you know with hud and those things are covered already so they’re dealing with that we’ve got you know constant constant surveillance of the hot water system here heating system elevators are outside that well that’s a good point they’re outside that in that sense you know we don’t have people monitoring the number of breakdowns and that sort of thing how long it takes to fix an elevator how many times in a particular day has it gone down that sort of thing i’ll tell you this much the elevator crews that work on the elevators had been in the past and probably are still today for a time being um they have to run around to different uh developments you know far apart from each other now they’re putting into pods that are close by so that they travel a short distance um one of the cruises headquartered in my building here 10th avenue uh so they don’t have to run up to the bronx or wherever anymore they’re they’re all thinking close by but the elevators are a serious issue here serious it took us you know and i worked on this you know with even greg russ helped you yeah when we first met we’ve got the compactor finally replaced here took six months or more compactor the elevators are something else there’s gonna be a tragedy here you know it’s happening it seems like that you’re making a very good point if the fed requiring work on the on the boilers and roofs that maybe we should just focus on the elevators then yeah i would i just leave it at that and let people know that that really is an issue yeah okay all right so we’re going to keep it on just the elevators then is that can we have a quick show of hands on that is that good yeah yeah yeah all right um and i think that that’s gonna be then we’ll be able to call for a vote there is um somebody attending um a public member of the public member is attending um if that person wants to um add anything to this conversation if you just raise your hand either i think it’s star nine to raise your hand if you’re on the phone or just hit the raise hand button um and if not i’m gonna call for a vote before we so we can wrap up this conversation because i know a couple people are trying to get off this call right i’m not seeing the hand go up so um is everybody good then with the two the priorities as described by betty um betty and i will work on getting them formatted onto the form to get to the budget task force was meeting on thursday so we’ll have to get it to them before then um and bert is on the budget test for so he can clearly represent our viewpoints pretty strongly um kerry did you have something to say i saw your screen light up i’m just ready to vote all right excellent who am i all right um all in favor then you can do a physical raise of hand i’ll be able to see almost everybody except for carrie and michael hi hi carrie aye all right seems unanimous thank you okay all right i think we’re gonna be able to wrap i just wanted to make one other um notification to everybody the flatiron bid was supposed to be on this month’s agenda we did not do it this month because they really

we met with them um i had some meeting with them and jesse and tina i think we’re all like a month ago there was no real change to the bid proposal so they’re not coming forward yet but when they do they’ll come back to us again just if anybody has any questions on that you can really judge me i’ll be happy to talk about it all right thank you everybody and i know there was only one item on the agenda but you came out and we got a quorum and that was very good very productive thank you everybody good night guys thank you bye bye thank you